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  • W A V E
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2019-09-02 11:21:33  
I can't send proof of my records on Wii Sports Resort because the amount of MB on my picture proof is too high.
Can one of the moderators please respond to this and perhaps give me a Discord ID? I have Discord, and I wouldn't mind sharing my proof of my records (especially the ones of cycling because those are top notch) there, but I can't seem to share them here...

  • zephyraz
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2019-09-02 11:58:36  
As it is written in the FAQ (frequently asked questions) topic, for picture proofs you need to reduce the size of your picture below 250 ko.
Then, you should use a common software to do it (Paint, Powerpoint, Photoshop, ...).
The main place to send your pictures is VGR, it's not possible on Discord.
In the next future, there will probably be the possibility to link your records to other website like YouTube, but this is for videos.

  • W A V E
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2019-09-02 14:59:48  
So, uhm, in case that someone wants to see proof... what should I do?
I'm not very handy with Paint or any of the things you mentioned... I could redirect you to cyberscore.me.uk where I'm known as WAVEY? My proof does show up there.

  • zephyraz
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2019-09-02 15:57:27  
Sorry, but it's better for you to proove the maximum of your scores here, on VGR, especially if you are a newcomer.
Even if proofs are not an obligation on VGR, soon or later, someone can ask you a proof for any of your scores (supposed as high level ones)…
You probabbly don't know, but few years ago, people were obliged to proove for 1st places.
This rule was finally abandoned, because it was counter-productive, and too restrictive for majority of members.

I don't understand that you redirect us to cyberscore, especially if you suscribed there recently, and where it's really more difficult to find some of your proofs.
So I really advice you to learn how to resize a picture and send it here on VGR, or to ask to your friends or family to help you if you are not familiar with informatical basics.
Don't worry, it's always better to wonder how to proove, than passively wait an eventual ask (or deactivation) for your scores.
So I hope and wait for your next proofs here, for your own legitimacy, and for respecting the other VGR members, thanks.

2019-09-02 16:48:19  
Here is a few tips on the proving situation. 

If you click on the small camera icon next to the cups icon, you can see all the games proof. When you click on a game's records, you can either upload or drag a picture from your PC.
I noticed the limit on pictures you can upload there is bigger. Anything below 800kb should be able to upload. It just has to have an .jpg extension.

You can ask someone or just google how to resize pictures on your PC. When uploading pictures from my phone, I use a certain App to resize it below 250kb.

  • W A V E
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2019-09-02 16:51:04  
I found a website where it resizes images which I find easy to use, it's called resizeimage.net and I am going to try to upload proof of one of my times now.

  • W A V E
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2019-09-02 16:52:07  
It worked! Yay!
Thanks for your help guys.

  • MWT 2.0
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2019-09-03 02:26:22  
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqRtB1ie5p0

This is what I would rather do with my records from Burnout 3: Takedown. Its hard to get the pictures to come out accurately and under 250Kb. LOL

  • MBAcymru
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2019-09-04 19:25:08  
So I take pics on my camera on my phone and then I screenshot that pic and it reduces the size alot and just upload, very rarely I just crop it in my photos and is always enough to upload

  • Sellyme
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2019-09-05 11:22:26  

zephyraz :

As it is written in the FAQ (frequently asked questions) topic, for picture proofs you need to reduce the size of your picture below 250 ko.


That FAQ says that proofs have to be in the JPG format, and that they have to be under 250kB in size. Neither of these things are true.

For example, this proof of mine on 3003 Crystal Mazes is a 424kB PNG.

The reason people redirect to other sites is pretty simple to understand: the proof system on this site is absolute garbage, and the documentation for it is flat-out incorrect.

  • zephyraz
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2019-09-05 12:02:24  
@Sellyme: I just tried to help the newcomer WAVE, so calm down a little bit please.
I just told him what I know and what is written in the site, so if these informations are updated now, but not the FAQ in the same time, it's the responsability of admins, but not mine.
If me, you or anybody else find errors like this, the important is not to complain but tell it in the forum, in order to correct it.

Also, I think a new version of the site will allow more flexibility as now, especially for video proofs.
Unfortunately, there is a big lack of communication and information (or secret ?), so even me, as a Chief Proof Controller, I'm not consulted, and these upgrades are only hypothetic.
I just can moderate your "absolute" remarks: the VGR proof system is quite good actually, because no other site has such a known global prooving rate (more than 30%).
It exists since 12 years, it worked well until now.
Also, if in your case, your are not the most frequently user of the proof system (3,7% proven scores...), so you can better contribute to the situation: by prooving more, and by finding some constructive ideas to improve this situation.

  • Sellyme
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2019-09-06 15:09:46  

zephyraz :


Also, if in your case, your are not the most frequently user of the proof system (3,7% proven scores...), so you can better contribute to the situation: by prooving more, and by finding some constructive ideas to improve this situation.


I do not bother proving records except where required BECAUSE the system is so terrible that it would be a waste of everyone's time. This is why I've got well over 11,000 proof screenshots saved on my computer but have uploaded just ~1700 of them. Instead of being a matter of minutes to upload the rest, it would take several days.

I suggested improvements within hours of joining the site because it was so blindingly obvious that a system that ostensibly only accepts JPG screenshots should have been replaced some time around 1997. It's been over a year since then and nothing has happened. Since then I've realised that this site is comically understaffed and even issues requiring urgent moderator action takes months if not years to actually happen, so I've stopped bothering. We're just 25 days away from a third consecutive tournament that I'm going to have to deliberately lose in because the rules have been applied inconsistently for over six years and staff have refused to clarify on what's actually allowed. Fixing the proof system is pretty easy, but it's clearly not going to happen any time soon given the abysmal attitudes towards it. Especially with this kind of nonsense:

the VGR proof system is quite good actually


It requires that files be named "*.jpg", no matter what their file format is. This is just comically terrible programming.

It requires files be compressed below ~800kB, which requires extremely heavy compression. Having a file size limit makes sense, but having it be lower than a 720p screenshot is absurd, and not simply doing the compression on the server if the file exceeds a reasonable limit is incredibly disruptive to the proof uploading process.

These heavily compressed proofs are almost completely worthless, because they don't actually prove anything. Unnatural JPG artefacts and ELA in a screenshot are usually an easy way to tell if they've been doctored, but because this site attempts to actively mandate that, an edited proof is almost indistinguishable from a legitimate one.

It does not allow for proving multiple records with a single screenshot, something easily done in many games, that would potentially de-duplicate up to 100 proofs at a time. Instead of uploading a single high quality 2MB screenshot of a level select menu, I have to upload 100 copies of the same blurry and artefacted 300kB JPG, wasting bandwidth, storage, and time.

It does not allow for easily proving records from external sources, something that would allow for records to be proven programatically just by using consistent naming structures. For example, if I play the Sven Egevad Collection on 3003 Crystal Mazes and upload all of my proofs to an FTP server with the names 0001.png, 0002.png, [...] 1381.png, 1382.png (something I have actually done), then I should be able to very easily just point to that folder and tell the site to populate all levels in that category with their matching proof via that URL. Instead I have to upload every single one of them individually, which I'm not going to bother doing.

As already covered, the documentation lies. If you're going to have such a contrived and anti-user system in place, the least that could be done is to make sure that there's some resource for working out how to work around it, rather than one that actively misleads people. And it's not like this hasn't been brought up before. Note that this is over a year old, and the documentation - literally just plain text that could be fixed in seconds! - is still as incorrect as it was then.

Add all of this to the laundry list of other tangentially-related issues (not being able to see fulfilled proof requests, invalid proofs routinely getting accepted, heavily limited proof requests, and absolutely zero staff communication with users who want to remove their own invalid and unprovable scores), and it's very clear that the proof system is horrendous.

Also, I think a new version of the site will allow more flexibility as now, especially for video proofs.
Unfortunately, there is a big lack of communication and information (or secret ?), so even me, as a Chief Proof Controller, I'm not consulted, and these upgrades are only hypothetic.


That would be nice, but like you said, the complete lack of communication is hardly encouraging. Additionally, from what's visible on the Gitlab repository there's not exactly a whole lot that makes me confident about v7 being either a significant improvement or even likely to actually be implemented any time soon. Perhaps all of the improvements are in the private one instead, but I'm not going to be holding my breath either way. This should have been fixed over a decade ago.

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